Introducing CERIPH!

The global markets have dropped, COVID-19 has most of the world in lockdown and social distancing is in place – so there’s never been a better time to launch a talent related business! Join Neil, Simon and Ken on this first discussion – where the importance of living your values, thinking about your brand story post pandemic and a debate about elastic waist bands all feature.  

Transcript

spk_0:   0:04
hello and welcome to the first ever podcast from sheriff called the Final Details. Our aim is to cover relevant themes and use impact in the talents face in doing so, stimulate thinking, inform and even educate talent leaders. We're gonna be interviewing and inviting in our connexions clients and guests to grab a coffee and share their views and opinions on trends surfacing all challenges they're facing relating to people and talent overall. So for the first final detail, I'm joined by my co founders, Simon and Ken, and we're gonna talk about a number of different things. The 1st 1 being starting a business when I think the markets dropped to the lowest level for decades, we're in lock down at the moment. That could be a better time right

spk_1:   0:45
there. We were waiting for the world to clap way had all the handle the paperwork done. Now we're just waiting on the announcement locked down and then we thought that would be a perfect time to get going. You know, I think is you know, coming from Liverpool coming from Wales and coming from Newcastle, then you know we like life a little bit off on DH no tougher challenge ahead of us. However, I think the time in the market is absolutely right. Well, what we do on DH thie importance of communication, the power of great storytelling There is never beena Brett better time to support organisations that Storey make those emotional connexions with people.

spk_2:   1:30
I mean started the business within the first couple of days and upload a term I'd never heard before And that was furloughed mean, what was that all about? But that's now kind of new reality. So yeah, tough times, tough times but as you say can loads of opportunity Why now? Because we can do it better. We can do it differently without being contrived. VeriSign Elements of serif really important to us the creativity the emotional Connexion that we're looking to Teo create with people. So through the storytelling that we're doing, I'm a massive believer, particularly through so the digital channels and that sort of stuff, looking at segmentation of audiences, making sure that what we're saying to people is relevant. No, just making sure that we have a conversation in the right way with the right people the right content. So that way we are relevant clearly insightful insight is obviously important to me a lot. My background is his insides strategy. So insightful is is really important. I think a lot of people lose sight of translating the research into proper inside wants inside Really mean, understand inform the creativity, the innovation on DH, the foundation of efficiency. I think in future podcasts will probably talk about purpose and again, don't want that to be kind of a buzz word. You seeing quite a lot of that on leaked in a place like that round purpose. But I think it is important that we recognise some of those things around being the emotive ly connected, relevant on so on. And then I think most importantly and I think this is where it can it can, is the master of human. He's absolutely focused on that. We wanted to create come backto our previous question. Why now? We want to create something that is damn ready Could work with really good people.

spk_0:   3:18
This is the power of the podcast where we take a look at the strange, irreverent, bizarre happenings in the world of talent and things that caught our eye over the last week or so So usually we would ask our guests to show what they've seen. But for the first podcast, Jeffs, it's gonna be over to you. So you would like to start. I'll

spk_2:   3:35
have a go. Um, don't already saw this. But in the daily mash, which I tend to dip in and out over an arrogant, entitled man struggling to remember what you did in the before times. Ah, like a chap called Wayne Hayes. Who? A CZ The article goes that he was an accountant. We went designer or possibly even a technical writer on. He spent since the knockdown, wondering what he used to do five days a week. He knows his career used to be involved. Used to involve turning on a computer after that is completely blank. Hey said that was a ping Pong table, but I don't think that was my job. I feel important to remember. It's Monday, even now is, uh, playing skyrim until 3 a.m. Last night on. Then he says, right at the end, he says, holding up a pair of football boots said, I also have these special shoes, and for some reason, I think let's do it a man called Lee and Thursday nights, but not sure what. So there you go, What's happened to people since since we've gone into lock down, struggling to remember what their jobs were all

spk_0:   4:44
about. That's or a piece around. You know just how many pairs of pyjamas if you gotta wear on Ah, on the Zoom or Google Hangout meeting for the week and you change your pyjamas every day and then let work get in the way in between. So I think there's a lot of, ah, lot of interesting stuff out there right now. I think there's

spk_2:   5:03
a possibility we having this conversation the other night on a zoom hangout chat with some friends that made her the world's never gonna go back to wearing anything other than elastic ated waist trousers.

spk_0:   5:13
Cook. The new normal business attire can see one of the German street kind of Taylor's putting some new stuff on the windows with Start My Pyjamas last Decatur Band

spk_2:   5:23
and one other thing I did see this week was on the seventh sort of vain. Ah, guy, he was struggling in lock down to come to terms with not having routine, so he does actually get up at the same time, he would go to work normally, gets dressed in a suit, made himself a coffee in a travel mug on DH, then heads out in his car, needs us 15 laps of his cold sack and partners parts from the verge just round the side of his house and passed. Why he does that, you said, Well, I like to keep routine and the fact that I could never get a parking space at work. It seems wrong to park on my own drive, which then led me to thinking about a time when a Z youngster, my first ever account exact job done over towards the House, has not been out to park and quite stressed, that was like for a meeting back then. Actually, Norman used to Runner, who was then with the chief exact used to run a monthly employee recognition ski. I s O employee of the month will be given a parking space at the front of ASDA house with a golden comb. I didn't know this at the time, so I rocked up as their heads to five laps of the carpark saw a space of the cone and it moved it parked in it, only to be dragged out of the meeting about 45 minutes later to tell her from me that I've been arrested.

spk_0:   6:44
Thanks, Simon. Well, thanks for captured. I'm sure gonna get from Reverend storeys over the next few weeks. Aspired his podcast, but as a cracking starter, Thank you.

spk_2:   6:52
We must go to the type of the podcast because otherwise I would be a missed opportunity. It's called the finer details. Why is it called the fine of Vito? You know

spk_0:   6:59
our business. We talked about the final details of world importance. Whether that be a project plan, whether it be delivered on time two clients needs or actually, you know, going out of our way to find the best creative support for what we do. So, you know, the final detail are all important. So a lot of people today finding a challenge of remote working and happened to be in their virtual teams were actually from the very beginning, we want to set up surf in a kind of virtual kind of ecosystem, right? What do you kind of thoughts on that?

spk_1:   7:29
I think we wanted to be agile. It gives us that flexibility to not pass on expensive overheads. Be working with a kind of an ecosystem, one like of like minded people who bring different skills and different abilities to the table. Whether that writing with design with a vigil, expertise about cognitive experience, I just think that virtual model something that's absolutely on attuned to the needs of what businesses are going to be using us for. Yeah,

spk_0:   8:06
I go back to some of the heyday in the creative side. And some photographers, other Streeters, you know, filmmakers you would never have them on staff, right? You'd have. They're living, breathing that 24 7 So when you need to find the right expert to complete a project, you know, this mother allows us to do that right.

spk_1:   8:23
It allows us to bring, um, you know, the right skills, the right experience and the white abilities, rather than deliver what I would call a one size fits all model to the projects that were working on Ben, you tend to get some kind of outputs with having this agility flexibility that we got a system that we are creating that will continue to evolve. I think that brings the light about.

spk_0:   8:50
Absolutely. Simon, We I mean, this is kind of the discussion that we wanted to have on this first podcast. And, you know, we talked about covert. We can't ignore it. We're all on lock down. Everybody seems to be on VTs all day, all day long in the moment. But, you know, I still locked down and asked a cove it There's gonna be a storey right that organisations need to tell to engage and not just actually employees or candidates were also customers. So there's a big change going on out there. People have had to adjust. They've had to look after kids home, get set up for remote working. Then you think about the change curve. You know, it's a shock factor and coming to terms with it and suddenly the start to get her to do list. And, you know, start focusing on work will be in kind of sporadic hours. So, Sam, what do you kind of thought on this storytelling elements after Cove? It So

spk_2:   9:43
I think some really interesting stuff in this in what's happening to people a lot of situations. Previously we've we've looked a different economic cycles different financial crises. All of those swords things, And every time that you've got to one of those for most people, we've been able to look at it and say one minute, somebody to blame for this and whatever your views are covert and where this came from and how it came about. The reality is this is a natural disaster in equivalent and so therefore that there isn't almost a point of anger for people. There isn't a point of reference to say, Oh, that happened, Mom in this situation. So I think for a lot of people their experience, their very own situation of what cove it means to them. So for some people, they're busier than ever. You know, we've got our frontline nurses and care workers who we've gotta be massively grateful for, absolutely busting a gut and busy and they've ever be. When we come out of this, what's gonna be their response? Or they're gonna take the pride of being able to make a difference and therefore, you know, that will sustain them through on DH. Maybe about they'll get better rewarded on DH some of those things afterwards, But some of them they may think. Well, that was my I've done my bit name. I'm going to step out for the other end of the scale. You've got people who were incredibly busy than who now. Probably have a bit of a void on a sat there thinking. Right. Okay, So what I was doing before Is that what I want to be doing? Moving forward? Yeah, we'll actually have. I started to get to enjoy that. More time. My family have. I thought you know what? Doing some local deliveries to the community delivering prescriptions. That's what a real buzz out of that. Is that something that, you know, I'd like to find a bit more balance with some of those things. So, um, or more many thing, I think it's it allows. It's created almost a natural pause for people to go. What am I actually doing? Yeah, and is he rightly said, you know, you've got people doing things that they would never have dreamed of doing. You know, I I'm delighted when my kids got to school that I don't have to teach them because I'm a terrible teacher, you know, I got to sit there and do times tables. My daughter, You know, I'm having to learn new skills. I do know the times tables, obviously. Well, I think, um well, they have the patience to sit there and go through and encourage. And that's the stuff some people haven't. Strong new skills. I think it opens up a lot of different questions. A lot of different for process of people will be really interesting to see the roots that people go down after his mother doesn't really change anything or whether everybody is so desperate to get back to normal that that normality just overrides everything. And people just go. I can't wait till we're back to where we were.

spk_0:   12:33
Yeah, yeah. No, I'm thinking

spk_1:   12:35
I absolutely agree with you, Simon. I think people are defined a wood and through what normal actually is to them. Andi, you know my hope we can through this is actually businesses start to behave in a different way. Um uh, you want to see that trust being established through really honest dialogue between people in organisation or organisations and their people on DH? You know, sometimes organisations dress up on don't tackle some of the hardest using some of the challenges that are facing. And I think that's a mistake in an instant, a lost opportunity cause I think if you're very honest and transparent with you then people know that the world of work on DH being unorganised running an organisation that's challenging you laughing the more honest, more transparent that businesses are people Then they start to establish a greater on the trust My hope that organisations coming through these hard climbs stunt will recognise that I think through storytelling through great communication they've got a really good opportunity. Teo lines

spk_0:   13:57
come The other side is their loyalty factor. Here is this idea that you know what I had before I was with this organisation for for several reasons But now the way some organisations are behaving well kind of test that loyalty either

spk_1:   14:13
in a

spk_0:   14:13
positive or negative way, right?

spk_1:   14:15
Yeah, I absolutely and I think, you know, lead it leaders half we absolutely transparent They've gotta faces the challenges and the communicators challenge challenges in a very honest and open way And I think you know that defines our redefines Think what the employer brand is about needs to people he glossed It's about on what went down and give us an organisation unequally. What we expect to get in return business is new To communicate the challenges and the vigils, Um, in a very honest and open, very human way to people notice to build up very clear in open and direct dialogue.

spk_2:   14:59
Yeah, I just I just got a couple of thoughts on that. I mean, I think one of the interesting things may well be how organisations have perceived to have managed their message through this. And I think there is a danger for some organisations that they we're gonna miss the point to a certain extent. And I think using the knowledge that you have of your employee base is gonna be massively important in this because of how you've managed to communication through covert itself through that period. Because I think, you know, for some organisations I get things like virtual yoga sessions. I get things like wellness sessions. That's for stuff. It's important, Okay, but actually, for a lot of people they're worried about, where's their income coming from? Are they ever going to be going back to work after they've been furloughed? You know what is the world of work in the mean to them. How's my organisation gonna recover from this? What's gonna be the long term pain that we're gonna have to suffer that at the back of it? Yeah. And we've almost gone back to other basics of match those hierarchy of needs, which is now I'm gonna be safe, secure Guinness in an environment where you know that that comfortable. And I think for a lot of people, it's not like that anymore. And therefore, offering these what I would call almost discretionary benefits to people may not actually be hitting. The mark is also at the other end of the scale. What's my company being seen to be able to do to either help? The consumer will help its community. So you look at things like Dyson with no using its position as an innovator to create ventilators. That's great. Yeah, but you wouldn't have expected anything less from Dyson to a certain extent. So that's that's playing through for anybody. Work twice. And you said the only thing. Okay, I'm really proud of my organisation. I'd hoped that we'd be able to see something we haven't been able to do something. There'll be those that you know. Okay, Absolutely. We're going to support you through the tough times. We're gonna keep paying you the full amount. We don't need to furlough. You will find a way of making it work. And then there's potentially dangerous, you know, we're making yeah, generous choices for everybody that eventually could cost everybody. Yeah, the security and the safety sowing some really tough decisions for people out there. How they managed their people proposition how they manage their positioning of their organisation as a whole. Um, he had not just consumers, but also to their own employees. Yeah, and that's, you know, I think that comes back to a point around. Yeah. What's the storey that you want to tell when you when we come out of this for what is the narrative? What's the underlying message that people would have picked up both your own employees and also people Do you think, you know, I really like the way they organise that organisation. Handled themselves through through covert.

spk_1:   17:50
But I think Simon know through all of that, there are there are two foundation. This is the 1st 1 is honesty, and the 2nd 1 is transparency Andi, you know you've got to be if you don't communicate and tell your Storey in the right way is a business. And internally you kind of create this. You know this environment of anxiety and stress and that's where an organ, that's where an organisation loses control of its storey because it's the employees, then they what's going on Onda Storey that comes out quite often is not the storey that an organisation would want. And you know, we know in tough times that physical compensation got to be hard. But the more honest in, the more transparent you are about it, the stronger the trust bond with that becomes that are that builds between employees and the organisation.

spk_0:   18:48
Yeah, you're absolutely right. And I think that counterbalance isn't it. I think you know if if there is some negativity that is allowed to build because in the lack of any other clarity, then you know people will go online. We'll talk about this socially. They'll share. It's the it's the kind of glass door versus social stresses the debate, you know, glass door people, light events and kind of share things that happened. But if there's no counterbalance if there's no other, you know, storytelling across different channels to be the counterbalance, then you know you're going to believe what on the glass door or otherwise. Right? So there has to be some framework to communicate and help people need in these times to make sure that they're feeling these can or they're feeling like there, you know, they released in the no right There's no hidden kind of agenda.

spk_1:   19:38
Yeah, absolutely. It zits the stress and anxiety not knowing Yeah, nothing organisations have, you know and that the country gets too mental health office But I think organisations have hunted confidence to communicate very candidly with their employees. I go back to something ducks on DH. You know my grandmother I always used to say and that if something, it is somebody there's something Well, a somebody there's something good, then recognise it and say thank you. And I think we are seeing that you know, you look at the thanks that we are given towards, you know, the with the heroes in the in the n h s and beyond um, you know, saying thank you to somebody recognising what they've done. What they've contributed goes hell of a long way in unleashing gots discretion re efforts which a lot of organisations strike ful. Andi. So little things like sane from who I think of a massive on our organisation organisation performance.

spk_0:   20:54
Two little words that means so much better so often not used, right, particularly in absolute you know, you see that now and clapping out outside the doors and some of the wonderful films that I happened across the country. You know, people are recognising equally in the Corporates face and I people celebrate success as opposed to just once hit another number or not saying thank you to each other because they're too busy to say thank you. I think you know, I would hope this kind of work violence shift, um is recognised coming here this side as well right we talked about does work become part of your life ecosystem as opposed to having a higher percentage than a lot of other things that are so important? Is this period of time going to give people the need to re balance and our employees is going to be able to recognise I come the other side, you know well, people want to drop into the into the office now. A supposed to be based in an office, you know, is real estate price is gonna change the result on DH, You know, also generational differences, right? You know, there is some research so recently that said that, you know, Jen said, actually, our missing the work place because they liked that camaraderie. They miss the conversation, they miss working with the project teams. And actually, if they're flat sharing or the living in the path of a city where you know, they just don't have the opportunity to remote work easily, then they won't be back in the workplace. S o I mean interesting kind of change in this work, balance, shift, somebody, any kind of sort around that for

spk_2:   22:23
lots of people, lots of teams organisations, the transition to working videoconferencing. That sort of stuff, I think, has been reasonably straightforward. And I think it will be an eye enough of lots of people in the case, really not that difficult. I think one of the key audiences for me here is I thinkit's much easier to do the video conferencing and create team on DH team dynamic when the organisation has a LL bean together. Previously. I think the challenge would be, if you're working remotely in large teams, is when you need to AMP. That's when you have talent. 13. Because the opportunities, then to have that of physical, one toe, one, you know, relationship build that it's so important in an office environment I think becomes much more difficult. I think there will be some challenges get around. But I think all of these things will drive changes in technology. How do we get around that stuff? Some change in behaviour, some differences arounds with on boarding, all of that kind of thing. People will think about a little bit differently. But I mean, I you take it to what extreme we see. See the high street struggling. You know, you see people perhaps rethinking their commute to work. You start thinking about Okay. I'm quite happy working on my own remotely for three hour, five days a week. But I'd love to be able to go mix with some people for a couple of days week. Well, does that increase in my hot desk in? Does that potentially to say Look at the High Street? Could there be almost. I drop in centres that people can go into a little bit like that. They're really flexible. We work, Regis, whatever it is type environment where you do you go in, grab a coffee, quiet space. A little bit of networking. No, that sort of stuff. Mohr community focused the necessarily thinking, You know, I'm gonna keep schlepping up to London or into one of the big cities or whatever. I think there will be some interesting dynamics existing on that. People start thinking. Okay, What is this? What is the balance that we need to hit in terms of London? No. Does this give more opportunities to have more remote teams And therefore, you know, things like the Northern powerhouse, those sorts things. Perhaps this may be a facilitator around that in the company's may start just thinking a little bit differently about whether talent needs to sit.

spk_0:   24:46
Yeah, absolutely. And I can Yeah. I mean, we we thought about that before, right? This kind of idea of a shift in the balance of power in the country across not just the UK, across Europe, right? I just

spk_1:   24:55
hope that this sees the death of presents season and that organisation start to trust the people that we measure people on output and contribution productivity and rather than Andi evaluate the performance on being in an office and sitting and sitting between the same four walls between 19 5 I just hope we don't see that again and that we trust people to work the way that they feel most comfortable where they can be as productive as they possibly can be, whether that be in a in a wee workspace, whether that be at home, whether that be in a cafe where, whether that be in physical space with colleagues, I don't think it matters. And I would hope that that leadership attitudes change Ondas a consequence on these trying times that we're going through.

spk_0:   25:53
And you know

spk_2:   25:53
that's gonna be hard, isn't it? Because, you know, for some of the industry's most affected, where you look ATT, retail, hospitality, leisure, those sorts things you worry about what's gonna be needed to drive a recovery for some of those businesses on DH flogging. Ah, flocking a workforce to get themselves back to where they need to be is a bit of date, but of a dangerous So for some industry, some sectors on it has to be really hard because the needs and generate the pounds and stimulate that recovery. Is this gonna put pressure on a lot of work forces? So there's there's gonna be a bit of conflict, I think, in organisations that can manage to get their heads round. You know, the new world of say, not having present he is, um, but also at the opposite end of the spectrum. You know, people just being worked and worked and worked because, you know, the corporate Snead need Teo needs change their fortunes.

spk_0:   26:56
Yeah. You know, it's interesting if you think about the models of work and how organisations are gonna need to adapt. Come on, the other side of this, you know, Do they do they need to change that business model didn't need to come. You get used to the fact that you know, people are gonna necessarily rock up into the retail environment and they want much more of the emerge mint and they can They can get that online and kind of see in a different way and in a similar way, in which kind of you know it says what'll Microsoft or or even Apple? Right? At one point when they had these areas that you could drop into and took feel sense the brand are supposed to buy in store. You know what? I changed. Well, I mean to be less retail staff in the store. Will it mean that you know you're going to experience the brands, but then you go online and buy it? It's an interesting one, too, to see if there will be a shift right?

spk_2:   27:48
Definitely just consumer behaviour and consumer mentality on DH. Looking at employees, candidates, you know, brands, that sort of stuff you were all consumes or something. There will, inevitably, some sort of mindset shift. You know the trick. I think for a lot of people be working out what that is and trying to be ahead of the curve on it because, you know, the danger is particularly when you look ATT talent. I think we will see a drive to even Mohr technology, and we already know that a lot of those people in demand So software developers and engineers and that sort of stuff that battle for that talent could ing could be even greater perhaps those people that have been furloughed or you are out of work at the moment, they might be spending the time doing some educations and learning about go to set themselves up for the future because I think it will be different.

spk_0:   28:46
Interest on the candidate also looks at an employer as well that it didn't change there because, you know, way knew from a from a graduate perspective. We always talked about the journey off. You know, they go to the corporate website first rate toe. Look at ethics values behaviours. Do I resonate? And then I'll go to the Careers website and on the careers website who's like me? Who can I empathise with? One of my career path looked like, um and then, OK, take that box. Then we'll go to social media and find out. Okay, what projects are you working on now? What's happening today? Um and then make the decision about plane you think about some of the content has got to adapt right to reflect the change in organisation and actually, what will What will The kind that it's going to look for come the other side that is Tio Tio make sure that they don't feel like that Organisations right for them Yeah I just

spk_2:   29:39
be great You know you go to a corporate website e always baffles me A little bit wider career section of a website appears so far down the list of priorities for organisations And if if one thing that could come out of this if if it's taken this for us to understand how important is that we look after our people on the value of our people Brand Yeah, your time like this If nothing else, If that's moved up discussion for him then I think that's a good thing

spk_1:   30:09
but absolutely And I think it goes back to a point you made earlier Simon about purpose. People want to contribute to society and the communities Andi organisations have got to find a way as you know whatever they do, they're gonna be able to show that there is that they can touch both of those points through The purpose of why they exist is an organisation. Um because that's the thing that's gonna make the emotional Connexion with the people who are working there and also the people who should be working that I just don't know it yet.

spk_0:   30:45
There's almost a piece that I can which you know this idea, that there's always being a different levels of activity, from a value proposition perspective for different organisations. We talked about Global message. We talked about regional than in country and then target segments, but actually is the in country now becoming the community, you know? Is there a piece here which is what is your value proposition for your community? And then think broader and wider, you know, will be a shift change there,

spk_1:   31:14
I think. Well,

spk_2:   31:16
the way that Corona viruses reported is cut this country comparisons country comparison because there are, you know, patterns that people are looking for and there are interventions that countries have made. So you look for the testing in Germany. You look at every relating kind of the line of travel always gets referred to. You know what's happening in Italy. You know the horrendous things. Yeah, these him, Spain and other places, and we refer to as, you know, what Germany doing. What's Italy doing? What's France doing? And it seems to me that we've become almost a little bit more insular in our thinking in the, you know, this's and maybe that is the community element, the fact that as a nation we've got to come together, we've got to think about you know, that social responsibility, that collective responsibility for this was social distancing, those sorts of things that does drive this sense of, I don't know, collective mindset that between us, we can achieve something

spk_0:   32:18
here. And I

spk_2:   32:18
think because it's on our shores and because it's it's obviously relevant. It's R N HS system. It's all of that stuff in each country is going through their own version of covert. And I just wonder whether local will become a bit more important than global. Um, and therefore that the translation of that into people brand proposition mejust require further back to the point of relevance and segmentation. We may seem or specific, no country by country proposition. What meaning that has what relevance that has to national audience, more so than trying to create a global perspective, which is often being the no, the challenge. How do we had captured global commonality with a little bit of local variation, whereas I think it might be a little bit more around the local is the important bit than How do we show that collectively globally from there?

spk_0:   33:21
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. It's gonna be interesting plays over the next few weeks.

spk_1:   33:26
Sometimes quite therapeutic, I think. And listen in here that you might be doing the right thing in your organisation, or there might be no part of this where you think. Yet that's an interesting point. I'd like to explore it further. So just being the catalyst, I think for the debate and conversation and ideas, Absolutely. That's that's what this is all about. For me, it's tough. It's about sharing in support, right?

spk_2:   33:55
Yeah. It's also, you know, going back to where we were one of the early points. This where we set up a business that is operating virtually. Yeah, we're always doing, really is recording a conversation to be that certain things that were going on, it's no more complicated than that. Really?

spk_0:   34:12
Yeah, absolutely. Okay, well, that was the first in a series of podcasts, cover and relevant themes. And in the town of space, we're going to continue to do this. So if you'd like to take part, have any questions or indeed any subject you want to cover on here on the final details. Then please let us know contact info at sir, if the code that UK Elvira website surf dot co dot UK Other than that, guys that have been the 1st 1 Thank you on DH before it's the next.